The B word...

So there has been a lot of talk on here about busts. Sadly many are pointing out guys with one year of playing time and using the label. IMO that is ludicrous. That said I believe there are several that should be on the bust Watch List this season. Here is mine and why:

DG-he has been very inconsistent. At times, he has shown shades of what earned him so many accolades in HS. Other times he he has been down right awful. Personally I give him a pass up until this year. This is the year he has to put it together or bust label he gets from me.

Frank Clark-Another Senior with the same inconsistencies as DG. We have seen the good and bad out of him. This year he has to play solid.

Countess-I think he has been more consistent than the previous two. Still I have not seen greatness that he seems destined for. He has seen playing time since he was a freshmen and now enters with a ton of experience. He earned the #2. Now he has to live up to it.

Honorable Mention-

Funchess-Another guy who shows signs of being the next great wr at Michigan and then disappears for stretches. He is a match up nightmare and should have an advantage against anyone he lines up against. Gallon is gone and we need our next go to wr. If this season is going to be good-to-great for us this offense needs to show signs of life. While the OL gets much of the criticism (well deserved) we also need a passing game. I'm tired of seeing 8-9 guys near the LOS. That puts the pressure on Funchess.

That's mine. Who is yours?

Not sure if I started this with my Greene comments a while back but again-I never said bust, I said MIGHT be a Disappointment which for me is not anywhere near bust level.

Can't go with Gardner at all not after all of his heroic performances last year. Countess for me only falls into the possible disappointment category. I am confident that Clark and Funchess will have big years this year.

Not really projecting anyone to be a bust this year.

'shoes

I really don't see a bust in this year's crop of seniors.

I see your logic but I don't think any of the guys you mentioned can ever be labeled busts.

Again, let me start by clarifying what I believe to be the levels of "label" when it comes to a player's performance at UM.

Bust
Under Achiever
Expected
Over Achiever
Trey Burke

So when I put one of the above labels on a guy it all starts with what was expected from them directly out of high school and not based on flashes of awesomeness during a particular year.

1. DG was a 5 star out of high school so that really eliminates the Over Achiever and Trey Burke labels. Also the real hype around DG wasn't just his dual threat capability, it was "holy shit this kid is gonna be great in Rich Rod's system." The beginning of his career definitely started out painfully slow. Not entirely his fault given the position changes and what not. Had he left the team two years ago I would say yes, he was a bust but IMO, DG did enough last year (his first full year as starter) to never be labeled a bust. At this point I would put him at Under Achiever given the extremely noticeable need for improvement with TOs. But I think if he has another 3000yds passing, 30+ total TDs, and keeps his INTs considerably lower this year I think you have to label him as Expected because he will have put up solid numbers in two full years of starting. IMO it's not fair to label a guy a bust if he only gets to start two full years because someone better was ahead of him.

2. Frank Clark's inconsistencies are annoying but remember Clark was only a 3 star out of high school. He actually wasn't that heavily recruited by other major programs. Clark's hype has always come from the analysts and scouts hyping him up during their pre-season assessments. FC was never expected to be all world yet he was B1G honorable mention last year in a conference absolutely LOADED with DE studs. Not too shabby for a "lowly" 3 star. IMO, at this time, FC can be labeled an "Over Achiever" and I think he could move very close to Trey Burke if he has a solid year and gets a second round draft grade for next year.

3. Blake Countess is a tough one. He was a composite 4 star so he came in on people's radars. On one hand, he showed so much his freshman year that you couldn't help but raise the bar for him and feel he was destined to be great. On the other he had to sit a year due to an injury. That said, he was tied for conference leader in INTs last year with 6. At the same time our Pass D was 7th in the conference last year with him in and 2nd in 2012 with him sitting. The jury is still out on him. He has two more years to play and I think he'll continue to improve both years. He's a solid option at CB so I doubt we'll ever be able to label him a bust.

4. Funchess... I was surprised he was even on the list. Yes he's a matchup nightmare. Yes his catching range is phenomenal. And sadly yes, he's prone to drop a few too many balls if you ask me. Still, he's our #1 WR this year. He could have a monster  year and that could put him as a possible first rounder in the NFL next year. I know that sounds ridiculous because we all know how much work he needs but his size alone will make people look twice at him. I heard someone say he's no Calvin Johnson but he's definitely on track to become a Brandon Marshall type receiver. I think if he continues to progress over the next two  years he'll be a sure fire first rounder and there is just no way you can label a first round draftee a bust.



You asked about who would be on my list for "bust watch". I'll name three.

1. Terry Richardson. Although I must say I had  him pegged as a bust from day one and expressed it on this board quite a bit back in the day. I knew he would never be the stud in college that he was at CT.

2. Dymonte Thomas. I haven't heard jack about him this off season. In fact I believe he's third string at this point. He was a 5 star in high school and I was so hyped to get him at UM. Not just to keep him from O$U but because I really thought he was gonna be all world right out of the gate. First game of the year last year WMU goes three and out to start the game, Dymonte gets in the game on special teams (his first game action as a college player), he blocks the punt, UM score a TD. I had the kid pegged sure fire NFL hall of famer at that point and then never heard his name mentioned again last year. He has three more years to play so it's way too early to put a label on him but he's on my watch list that's for sure.

3. Kyle Kalis. He never got better last year. In fact I think I could successfully argue that he got worse. He had a redshirt also so that makes me all the more worried. I'm going to be watching him intently when he gets back in the line up.

Too lazy to check right now but didn't Devin's TOs dramatically drop in the second half of last season?

wshoes wrote:

Not sure if I started this with my Greene comments a while back but again-I never said bust, I said MIGHT be a Disappointment which for me is not anywhere near bust level.

Can't go with Gardner at all not after all of his heroic performances last year. Countess for me only falls into the possible disappointment category. I am confident that Clark and Funchess will have big years this year.

Not really projecting anyone to be a bust this year.

'shoes

Not really any one person in particular. There have been several on here labeling Kalis and Green busts.

fishgoblue22 wrote:

I really don't see a bust in this year's crop of seniors.  

Think outside the box. Doesn't have to be a senior. 2 out of my 3 weren't. We have a ton of underclassmen with tons of playing experience.

wshoes wrote:

Too lazy to check right now but didn't Devin's TOs dramatically drop in the second half of last season?

 
Only 3 INTs in B1G play.  4 if you include the 2pt INT vs Ohio.
 
1 big fumble against Iowa though

sandyeggo_blue wrote:

I see your logic but I don't think any of the guys you mentioned can ever be labeled busts.

Again, let me start by clarifying what I believe to be the levels of "label" when it comes to a player's performance at UM.

Bust
Under Achiever
Expected
Over Achiever
Trey Burke

So when I put one of the above labels on a guy it all starts with what was expected from them directly out of high school and not based on flashes of awesomeness during a particular year.

1. DG was a 5 star out of high school so that really eliminates the Over Achiever and Trey Burke labels. Also the real hype around DG wasn't just his dual threat capability, it was "holy shit this kid is gonna be great in Rich Rod's system." The beginning of his career definitely started out painfully slow. Not entirely his fault given the position changes and what not. Had he left the team two years ago I would say yes, he was a bust but IMO, DG did enough last year (his first full year as starter) to never be labeled a bust. At this point I would put him at Under Achiever given the extremely noticeable need for improvement with TOs. But I think if he has another 3000yds passing, 30+ total TDs, and keeps his INTs considerably lower this year I think you have to label him as Expected because he will have put up solid numbers in two full years of starting. IMO it's not fair to label a guy a bust if he only gets to start two full years because someone better was ahead of him.

2. Frank Clark's inconsistencies are annoying but remember Clark was only a 3 star out of high school. He actually wasn't that heavily recruited by other major programs. Clark's hype has always come from the analysts and scouts hyping him up during their pre-season assessments. FC was never expected to be all world yet he was B1G honorable mention last year in a conference absolutely LOADED with DE studs. Not too shabby for a "lowly" 3 star. IMO, at this time, FC can be labeled an "Over Achiever" and I think he could move very close to Trey Burke if he has a solid year and gets a second round draft grade for next year.

3. Blake Countess is a tough one. He was a composite 4 star so he came in on people's radars. On one hand, he showed so much his freshman year that you couldn't help but raise the bar for him and feel he was destined to be great. On the other he had to sit a year due to an injury. That said, he was tied for conference leader in INTs last year with 6. At the same time our Pass D was 7th in the conference last year with him in and 2nd in 2012 with him sitting. The jury is still out on him. He has two more years to play and I think he'll continue to improve both years. He's a solid option at CB so I doubt we'll ever be able to label him a bust.

4. Funchess... I was surprised he was even on the list. Yes he's a matchup nightmare. Yes his catching range is phenomenal. And sadly yes, he's prone to drop a few too many balls if you ask me. Still, he's our #1 WR this year. He could have a monster  year and that could put him as a possible first rounder in the NFL next year. I know that sounds ridiculous because we all know how much work he needs but his size alone will make people look twice at him. I heard someone say he's no Calvin Johnson but he's definitely on track to become a Brandon Marshall type receiver. I think if he continues to progress over the next two  years he'll be a sure fire first rounder and there is just no way you can label a first round draftee a bust.



You asked about who would be on my list for "bust watch". I'll name three.

1. Terry Richardson. Although I must say I had  him pegged as a bust from day one and expressed it on this board quite a bit back in the day. I knew he would never be the stud in college that he was at CT.

2. Dymonte Thomas. I haven't heard jack about him this off season. In fact I believe he's third string at this point. He was a 5 star in high school and I was so hyped to get him at UM. Not just to keep him from O$U but because I really thought he was gonna be all world right out of the gate. First game of the year last year WMU goes three and out to start the game, Dymonte gets in the game on special teams (his first game action as a college player), he blocks the punt, UM score a TD. I had the kid pegged sure fire NFL hall of famer at that point and then never heard his name mentioned again last year. He has three more years to play so it's way too early to put a label on him but he's on my watch list that's for sure.

3. Kyle Kalis. He never got better last year. In fact I think I could successfully argue that he got worse. He had a redshirt also so that makes me all the more worried. I'm going to be watching him intently when he gets back in the line up.

Man I am torn by some of this. Here goes-

Disagree on Gardner. I think we as Michigan fans put too much emphasis on "Michigan Men" which values integrity and character over on field achievements. This is why you have 8-4 and 7-5 seasons. No I am not proposing we become the Raiders of CFB. I am saying is I won't give 5 star stud a pass because he's a swell guy. If that's the case then let's just recruit Eagle Scouts and call it a day. His season last year was average IMO. You can't just ignore the turnovers and I am not going to play the "well if you take out 3-4 games it wasn't that bad" game.

P.S-I think the world of character and am glad he is on our team. I give him a lot of credit for sitting the bench all those years with Denard at the helm. Still got to perform.

Clark-I could go either way here. The star argument cuts both ways. Yes he was a 3 star but with him I see a ton of potential. His combination of speed and size has me thinking very highly of him. I really would like to see him lead us in sacks this year and believe he should.

Funchess-you said "He could have a monster  year and that could put him as a possible first rounder in the NFL next year. I know that sounds ridiculous because we all know how much work he needs but his size alone will make people look twice at him. I heard someone say he's no Calvin Johnson but he's definitely on track to become a Brandon Marshall type receiver. I think if he continues to progress over the next two  years he'll be a sure fire first rounder and there is just no way you can label a first round draftee a bust."

I think some people are over thinking my OP. This is meant to be a watch list. I am not predicting them as busts. I like every other person on the planet come into a season thinking positive. I think Funchess and Gardner will do just fine this year. That said, I am saying if their season goes in the dumps I would label them as a bust. I cannot assume what these guys will look like 2 or 3 years down the road. I am just looking at their body of work to date. All of which would have enough to evaluate by then of this season.

Thomas and Richardson are great adds. I don't get the disdain for Kali's after one season of play. I know he was highly touted coming out of HS but I think 2-3 years is needed minimum before cast them off to Bust Island.

I thought Gardner had a very good season and I wasn't suggesting cherry picking 3 or 4 games to take out, I just said that the turnover problem was gone for the second half of the season or more. I loved Rick Leach, but compare his stats to Gardner's sometime (and I do know there is more to it than raw stats).

'shoes

Apples and Oranges. The game has evolved so much. Look at the numbers Manning, Brady and Brees put up. They are crushing record books but it's a different era.

Terry Richardson.

Dennis Norfleet.

Royce Jenkins Stone. (Although there are tons of good guys ahead of him and he's supposedly coming on.)

Justice Hayes. (Gonna catch it for that one.)

Delonte Hollowell.

Dymonte Thomas. (As I mentioned last year.)

Ross Douglass.



Now, I don't know that I'd actually label ANY of them busts.

In my mind Kelly Baraka was a bust. Kevin whatsisname from Grand Rapids was a bust.

C'Sonte York is a BUST!

MgoBlue wrote:

...Disagree on Gardner.  I think we as Michigan fans put too much emphasis on "Michigan Men" which values integrity and character over on field achievements.  This is why you have 8-4 and 7-5 seasons.  No I am not proposing we become the Raiders of CFB.  I am saying is I won't give 5 star stud a pass because he's a swell guy.  If that's the case then let's just recruit Eagle Scouts and call it a day.  His season last year was average IMO.  You can't just ignore the turnovers and I am not going to play the "well if you take out 3-4 games it wasn't that bad" game.

P.S-I think the world of character and am glad he is on our team.  I give him a lot of credit for sitting the bench all those years with Denard at the helm.  Still got to perform...

still gotta disagree with your thoughts on DG.


They guy had nearly 3000 passing yards and 21 throwing TDs. yes his INTs were bad but he did clean that up as the year went on. Of the conference QBs that started the entire season and had over 100 attempts he finished first in passing average and first in passing efficiency. To add to that he also finished 9th in rushing TDs.

To me that is hardly average.

I agree slightly more with you with your thoughts on Funchess now. "Could" was the key word in my post and it did not follow the nature of the OP. I will reserve my thoughts on DF until the end of the season.