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 Bye Bye Urban

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BOLEACH7

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PostSubject: Bye Bye Urban   Wed Aug 01, 2018 7:20 pm

You may be a great recruiter and game coach but once again you prove that you are scum
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dwoody



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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Wed Aug 01, 2018 9:21 pm

I'm on vacation w spotty interwebs. Did I miss something??
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BOLEACH7

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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Wed Aug 01, 2018 9:54 pm

Seems there’s evidence of his lying about Smiths abuse and that he didn’t know about it till recently.
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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Wed Aug 01, 2018 10:28 pm

dwoody wrote:
I'm on vacation w spotty interwebs. Did I miss something??

He's "probably" out for not divulging the assistant coach's domestic violence issues.

I'm saying I'll believe it when I see it.

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BOLEACH7

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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Thu Aug 02, 2018 8:42 am

With all the abuse scandals these days and with documented evidence there is no way Meyer survives this . Whereas buckeyes initially stood behind the Vest they have quickly distanced themselves from Meyer . They want in no way to have him near the program.
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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Thu Aug 02, 2018 8:59 am

Maybe- but is it as bad as Izzo and Dantonio covering up sexual assaults by their players?
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BOLEACH7

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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Thu Aug 02, 2018 9:06 am

Seems like there are texts that were sent and read by Urbans wife , so you gotta think he was told and it’s in his contract to report any instance of abuse by a member of his staff .
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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Thu Aug 02, 2018 9:14 am

wshoes wrote:
Maybe- but is it as bad as Izzo and Dantonio covering up sexual assaults by their players?

IMO, Shoes, it's no WORSE that the MSU situation (which also includes Larry Nassar), nor any worse than the cover-up (or at the very least, looking-the-other-way) of the Jerry Sandusky case by the Paterno Empire at PSU.

But it (current Meyer-OSU case) is seriously despicable regardless.
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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Thu Aug 02, 2018 9:56 am

Again we agree.
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flabluefan1



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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Thu Aug 02, 2018 3:41 pm

Not sure I've seen the kind of evidence in Meyer's case that there was in Tressel's case. We don't know if Meyer knew about the 2015 incident He admits he knew about the 2009 incident and says he tried to get the couple back together. With Tress there was hard evidence that he knew about the various violations by his players and not only didn't report them but lied under oath about them in a sworn stattement.

All the facts are not in to be sure but so far I'm not convinced that Meyer did anything wrong. I'm no fan of his but calling them as I see them.
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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Thu Aug 02, 2018 3:43 pm

So your assumption is that his wife didn’t tell him about the abuse that is documented in the text with Smiths wife ?
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flabluefan1



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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Thu Aug 02, 2018 7:36 pm

Not assuming anything. Assumptions are not evidence. You think Shelley Meyer is going to say she told him? She can't be compelled to testify against him. So where is the proof?
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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Thu Aug 02, 2018 7:45 pm

From what I understand Shelley Meyer is also an employee of OSU.

If this is true, she has an obligation to say something.

Could be dicey to say the least.

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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Thu Aug 02, 2018 7:46 pm

Well he said at media day that they talk about everything and that she is as much a part of the program as anyone. Can’t be compelled to say anything but this ain’t going away . He knew and being a RN she was compelled to pass on the info to superiors. So the school either knew and let Smith stay on staff which is an even bigger mess or Shelley Myers is in violation of not reporting abuse concerning university employees . Either way it is a huge mess
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flabluefan1



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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Fri Aug 03, 2018 12:30 am

Not saying he isn't guilty. Just haven't seen the conclusive proof yet if in fact it exists. The lawyer in me says the proof isn't there yet. I don't know what Shelley's position is with OSU or what obligation if any she had to report anything to the OSU admin. From a legal point of view still some open holes is all I'm saying.
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michmike



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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Fri Aug 03, 2018 8:40 am

FBF---I want your HONEST LAWYER'S opinion (though some may say that's an oxymoron, I'm NOT being facetious here) on my longtime theory about situations like this, which I've cited here umpteen times (perhaps most recently during the JoePa/JerrySandusky debacle).

I am firmly convinced that when you have a hierarchical structure---be it the gov't of a nation/state/city, a university, a corporation, a health institution, or an athletic program---the MAN/WOMAN AT THE TOP takes the ultimate credit---or BLAME.

First off, do you agree with the FACE VALUE of that assertion?  (Well, I'm sure you and I can agree on this part: he/she will ALWAYS take the CREDIT!!!!)

Secondly, let me briefly(?) explain.  The "head hauncho" is the face of the entity in the public eye. It is he who is immediately---and rightly---held publicly accountable for business, strategy or PR snafus which might befall the outfit...I think we concur on that.

Thus, to AVERT those snafus as best they can be, it is his responsibility to maintain "over-sight" (hyphen by intent; compare: "oversight") on the entity as a whole. Can any one person do so over EVERY level, ALL THE TIME?  Of course not.  That is where his subordinates come into play. He certainly HAS the time/ability to interact with an appreciable number---if not all---of them, and can expect accountability on their part. Agree or disagree?

Meyer, one would strongly think, has had subordinates over the past five years who knew, from one source or several, of Zach Smith's violent abuse of his wife. One of those, all media sources indisputably point to, was his own wife Shelley (whom Mrs. Smith confided in on numerous occasions). Whatever the validity of the age-old maxim respecting "the sanctity of confidence between husband and wife," Mrs. Meyer is also an employee, as a registered nurse, of an HMO...maybe even of OSU itself, I'm not sure. Is she not bound to report the disturbing news from Mrs. Smith to SOMEONE above her, if not directly to her husband (who moreover has termed her "a member of this football team")???

But back to the basic point: I contend coach Meyer failed miserably in his duty to ASCERTAIN odious goings-on within his entity(the OSU football program) in the Zach Smith case.

YOUR contention, please....
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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Fri Aug 03, 2018 9:11 am

michmike wrote:

Secondly, let me briefly(?) explain.  The "head hauncho" is the face of the entity in the public eye. It is he who is immediately---and rightly---held publicly accountable for business, strategy or PR snafus which might befall the outfit...I think we concur on that.

Thus, to AVERT those snafus as best they can be, it is his responsibility to maintain "over-sight" (hyphen by intent; compare: "oversight") on the entity as a whole. Can any one person do so over EVERY level, ALL THE TIME?  Of course not.  That is where his subordinates come into play. He certainly HAS the time/ability to interact with an appreciable number---if not all---of them, and can expect accountability on their part. Agree or disagree?

This reminds me of something I was told by a senior Marine when I was at the point to get enough rank to delegate some work to lower ranking Marines, and one of the jobs didn't get done. When I told him that I assigned it to so and so he said: "you can delegate authority but not responsibility". Meaning that even though I didn't do the work, it was ultimately my responsibility to ensure it was done correctly.

It is Urban's responsibility to know everything that is going on within the football program. If he didn't know, shame on him.
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BOLEACH7

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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Fri Aug 03, 2018 10:05 am

Shelley Meyer is an instructor at the tuos nursing school. She was duty bound to report those abuses to her superiors. She is an employee of the university
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flabluefan1



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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Fri Aug 03, 2018 11:32 am

Mike, not sure Shelley's position at the OSU nursing school requires her to report abuse of a football coaches wife to her superiors at the nursing school. According to Mrs Smith, Shelley said that she "had to report" the incident to Urban. Again not sure if there was any legal requirement that she report to Urban but certainly that was the right thing to do especially when Mrs Smith authorized her to do so. The question remains: did she in fact report it to Urban? If she did then he clearly lied about not knowing about it and should be fired. If she didn't shame on her and she should be fired.

I agree with all you say about the "head honcho" being ultimately responsible for what happens within his or her organization. I went to the Coast Guard Academy and had it beaten into my head that the Captain of the ship is responsible for what happens on the ship.

Urban's contract with OSU requires him to report all "known" violations to his AD. The term "known" is defined in the contract. As I recall 'Known" basically means both actually "known" or "should have known." Thus even if Urban didn't have actual knowledge, if he, in the exercise of due diligence, should have known, then he also should be fired. I think that this is the ppoint you were making and I agree with you.

Again I'm not saying he isn't guilty. I'm saying that so far the dots haven't been connected that he either knew or should have known of the incident. That's what the investigation will focus on and the results will decide his fate.
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michmike



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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Fri Aug 03, 2018 12:02 pm

flabluefan1 wrote:
"... I'm saying that so far the dots haven't been connected that he either knew or should have known of the incident.  That's what the investigation will focus on and the results will decide his fate."          


Whilst most all of your reply made good sense, FBF, those last 2 sentences (above) constitute its MOST sensible, logical, and legally tenable (after your wont---LOL!) portion thereof.

Letting the judicial process run its course---to COMPLETION---is an absolute must.  Slime-ball, two-faced-Charlie, guilty or innocent, Meyer is presumed the LATTER till culpability is PROVEN...to the best of the legal system's ability to prove, and the jurors'/magistrates' ability to judge.

It's why, as I'm sure you'll reinforce me, we have a CONSTITUTION, not a Torah or set of "laws" steeped in Marxism, Fascism or National Socialism.  

ALSO--- good to see you and Fish both concur with my assertion about "head honchos".  If the captain of the [literal or proverbial] ship doesn't have sufficient sense of the happenings on board, he's not doing his job, or better, ought to be REPLACED in the captain's chair...
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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Fri Aug 03, 2018 8:55 pm

The problem is that no judicial system will be involved.

This is not a legal issue. It is a moral issue.

I highly doubt that anyone will be under oath and obligated to talk or to tell the truth.

We've seen this before.

The only way it becomes a legal issue is if OSU sues urbs for his salary back.

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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Sat Aug 04, 2018 2:27 pm

True. But with the latest release from Urban its clear he just flat out lied in Chicago. Also Gene Smith took no action when he found out about the 2015 incident. The whole thing stinks but given the total infatuation at OSU with its football program I wouldn't be at all surprised if Urban gets reinstated and the whole thing gets swept under the rug.
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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Sat Aug 04, 2018 6:30 pm

flabluefan1 wrote:
True.  But with the latest release from Urban its clear he just flat out lied in Chicago.  Also Gene Smith took no action when he found out about the 2015 incident.  The whole thing stinks but given the total infatuation at OSU with its football program I wouldn't be at all surprised if Urban gets reinstated and the whole thing gets swept under the rug.  

That's unfortunately true.

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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Sun Aug 05, 2018 9:45 pm

dream on not going to happen. The guy has an immunity clause. He would have to kill someone

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PostSubject: Re: Bye Bye Urban   Mon Aug 06, 2018 7:04 pm

the artist formally known wrote:
dream on not going to happen. The guy has an immunity  clause. He would have to kill someone

Even then probably nothing, it is ohio...

Still, I think that there's a chance he walks away.

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