The author of this article

apparently doesn't have much faith in Hoke's coaching ability I would say. Doesn't even have M in the top 25 football programs for the next 10 years???? Ouch. But he has UTSA in it????

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2103158-predicting-the-top-25-college-football-programs-of-the-next-10-years?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=newsletter&utm_campaign=big-10-football

Yeah,  yeah, I know what you're all going to say......it's the Bleacher Report, blah, blah, blah.

But still, having all our rivals in there & not Michigan.....that stings.

Hope he's wrong.

That perception can change for the better (or be reinforced) after this season. I hope we are planning for the future and that Brandon has contingency plans depending upon how this season goes.

The best result would be a big improvement, a contract extension for Hoke and a raise for Nuss (because the offense improved so much).

'shoes

A lot of Michigan basketball fans, "experts" and bloggers (like the author of this article) didn't think John Beilein was the answer after year 3 either. I've learned to form my own opinions.

I was absolutely convinced Beilein WAS the guy after his first difficult season and year 3 and said so on the Mlive basketball forum going head up against sissyboy, vegas et al.

I see very little comparison between Beilein and Hoke. JB was a long time successful head coach at multiple venues. Brady was a sub .500 coach. JB was an innovative coach who employed out of the norm styles on offense and defense. Hoke was billed as a back to man ball guy (though the reality was different than that- having had his greatest success with small running backs and the dreaded 3-3-5 defense).

Beilein could have had a job at any number of D1 schools. Brady was rejected by Indiana.

Brandon sold an image with Hoke- sort of a back to Mich glory days and people's bias as to the style of football that Mich football should be.

This year is put up time. I hope mightily that he is able to do so.

'shoes

wshoes wrote:

I was absolutely convinced Beilein WAS the guy after his first difficult season and year 3 and said so on the Mlive basketball forum going head up against sissyboy, vegas et al.

I see very little comparison between Beilein and Hoke. JB was a long time successful head coach at multiple venues. Brady was a sub .500 coach. JB was an innovative coach who employed out of the norm styles on offense and defense. Hoke was billed as a back to man ball guy (though the reality was different than that- having had his greatest success with small running backs and the dreaded 3-3-5 defense).

Beilein could have had a job at any number of D1 schools. Brady was rejected by Indiana.

Brandon sold an image with Hoke- sort of a back to Mich glory days and people's bias as to the style of football that Mich football should be.

This year is put up time. I hope mightily that he is able to do so.

'shoes

+1

wshoes wrote:

I was absolutely convinced Beilein WAS the guy after his first difficult season and year 3 and said so on the Mlive basketball forum going head up against sissyboy, vegas et al.

I see very little comparison between Beilein and Hoke. JB was a long time successful head coach at multiple venues. Brady was a sub .500 coach. JB was an innovative coach who employed out of the norm styles on offense and defense. Hoke was billed as a back to man ball guy (though the reality was different than that- having had his greatest success with small running backs and the dreaded 3-3-5 defense).

Beilein could have had a job at any number of D1 schools. Brady was rejected by Indiana.

Brandon sold an image with Hoke- sort of a back to Mich glory days and people's bias as to the style of football that Mich football should be.

This year is put up time. I hope mightily that he is able to do so.

'shoes

We've done this back and forth many, many times. Why waste either of our time when by the end of the thread we agree on what we are saying?

1. We both believed in Beilein because we both understand how basketball works. Sissy said "Beilein's magic bus offense won't work" and deepblue83 said that "Beilein can't land blue chip recruits". Both were morons.

2. I'm well aware of Beilein's coaching pedigree. There is a really good 5 page article by, I think, the Free Press that talks about Beilein's history. It's a great read. The fact the their coaching pedigrees aren't similar doesn't mean there are no similarities in the situation. Speaking absolutes is for 4 year olds and politicians.

3. I'm not saying Brady Hoke = John Beilein.

4. After year #3 where John Beilein took a Michigan team that was preseason #15 (for the first time in years) and ended up regressing to a 15-22 record, many people were calling for his fire. These people didn't realize the importance of getting "Beilein" players in the system for his system to be effective. "ME" guys like Manny Harris did not work in Beilein's system. Likewise, I think it's important Hoke gets his guys in for his system.

5. It is a hell of a lot easier to turn a basketball program around. One or two good recruiting classes of "system" guys and the program is where you want it. Many more freshman and sophomore players are "instant impact" players in basketball than football. In football you have to give an extra year or two.



6. My point in this thread, was that people like Sissy and deepblue83 were probably writing Bleacher Report articles 4 years ago calling for Beilein to be fired. I'm glad I didn't let them convince me and hopefully I'm glad I didn't let people convince me on Hoke. I've kept to the notion that year 4 (this year) is a make or break year because Hoke will have two classes of upperclassmen.

I think year 3 was 15-17, not 15-22. Also while we share opinions on Manny Harris, JB did take us to our first NCAA tourney in a long time with him.

I have no problem with giving Brady this year to prove his worth. I'd even be OK with a 5th year if it didn't require an extension, but as I've said ad infinitum, I don't think that's an option as a practical matter.

I just don't think the evidence was there before we hired him, that would give us confidence that he was a strong choice for the position. I did think he could be very successful if we had an extremely strong staff of assistants across the board. That is true of a lot of coaches though and we are not paying him like an average coach.

'shoes

wshoes wrote:

I think year 3 was 15-17, not 15-22. Also while we share opinions on Manny Harris, JB did take us to our first NCAA tourney in a long time with him.

I have no problem with giving Brady this year to prove his worth. I'd even be OK with a 5th year if it didn't require an extension, but as I've said ad infinitum, I don't think that's an option as a practical matter.

I just don't think the evidence was there before we hired him, that would give us confidence that he was a strong choice for the position. I did think he could be very successful if we had an extremely strong staff of assistants across the board. That is true of a lot of coaches though and we are not paying him like an average coach.

'shoes

15-22 was off the top of my head so yeah you're probably right. Still, a losing record in year #3 despite starting the season ranked #15th was a huge red light to many impatient fans. I'm sure a lot of people here would have been saying "the program is REGRESSING! FIRE!" before Beilein ever had a chance to get his guys into the system. I know you would have been here telling everybody to be patient, though.  .

"You and all your Blue Groupie pals, when Beilien first got here, gave the expectation out that Beilien needed to make it to the Sweet 16, and back then it was thought to be ridiculously generous because most reasonable evaluations expected that by year three based on what Amaker left him in top NBA level talent (Udoh/Sims/Harris). Well, it's now Beilien's SIXTH year! Are you now saying he needs a period of TEN years to be expected to make it to the NCAA Sweet 16?!! That would seem to be taking Beilien Chasing Mediocricy Apologetics to a whole new level of absudity. Your expectations for Michigan basketball are one Sweet 16 appearance every ten years!? Seriously??!! Explain yourself. What year do you expect Beilien to reach the NCAA Sweet 16 and why. Facts only please!" - Sissy

Going back to the old forum and reading some of that stuff is priceless, but it has the same tune as a lot of the "Fire Hoke. PERIOD!" posts on here.

Wow- that brings back memories (not good ones). Sissy was crazy (literally). But Vegas who is a big Beilein booster now was almost as bad.

'shoes

"Ballhog Burke"
"Jelly-legs McGary"
"Selfless Akkune"
"Jumperless Hardaway"

to name a few lol.

haha- I liked Eso as much as the next guy, but somehow sissy saw talent in him that the rest of us did not. Also staggering to recall how much he criticized Trey.

hailtoyourvictor wrote:

"Ballhog Burke"
"Jelly-legs McGary"
"Selfless Akkune"
"Jumperless Hardaway"

to name a few lol.

The guy also called me racist and seemingly based that on my choice of handles.