We'll be back

I really wanted 2-2 during this last stretch and we only managed 1-3. Tonight's loss is still just one loss. We have a chance to run the table now. Whether 14-4 gets a share of a title I don't know. This probably was the death knell to win it outright.

Need to get Morgan healthy.

'shoes

I don't know. This was a very demoralizing loss.

I hate to be that guy and turn tail as soon as things go bad but I really have to question Beilein's system. There is no offense being created. It requires them to trade a center for a pf and tonight you see what happens. I have watched us get eaten alive by other teams big's. You guy's still remember Zeller right?

If we are hitting our 3's we have a chance. I just do not think it is a good long term good plan to trade off 3's for high percentage shots in the paint. That's what you do when your "big man" is a pf.

I am concerned going forward. All of a sudden every team we play "plays outstanding defense." Tired of hearing about that. It also appears that every team "shoots the lights out" against us. Translation our defense is shit. I really do not know what has happened but we can't defend anyone.

It's one game. Don't jump off the cliff.

I am not just basing my observations from last night. Hell my questioning Beilein's system is from years of observing his teams since he came to AA. We always struggle to rebound and defend other teams post players when they have guys that can play in the middle. I thought with McGary in addition to Horford and Morgan would solve that but it is apparent that unless we find Dennis Rodman reincarnated we will struggle to contain descent to good centers.

I hope today's practice involves a lot of sprints. Last nights performance was unacceptable. Duke was recently embarrassed and Coach K had the team practicing in the middle of the night.

We took exactly the same number of 3s last might as State. We have many games this year where we have DOMINATED the opposition on points in the paint. Our coaching is outstanding. IMO

'shoes

Good point on 3 attempts. Perhaps it is not the attempts so much but knowing when it is working and when it is not. Last night the three's were falling.

I take issue with your point that we have dominated the inside. Name a descent inside game that we dominated? Not Ohio,MSU, Wisconsin,IU. I can go back to NC St when Leslie had his way with us. Yes we won but he dominated us on the inside.

Sure we dominate Northwestern and eastern Michigan. That has pretty much been the case. I cannot think of any quality opponent with a good inside presence that we dominated. If there is one is it certainly is the exception.

You don't need great inside play in the NCAA tournament. The officiating isn't like in the B1G. The games are not brawls like in the B1G. The pushing and shoving is called in the tourney. UM will be at least a sweet 16 team.

Belien whole system is based on your foward hitting 3's an the other coach ajusting to that and bringing a smaller guy to cover trhat shot, but Robinson has done nothing there fore nobody has had to adjust and Robinson is forced to cover a big instead of the other way around

We'll see. I predict our tourney loss will come to a team with a good inside game. Anyone care to make a wager?

I did not say we had a dominating inside game but that we had dominated many teams on points in the paint- though not in our losses obviously.

Points in the paint includes all the back door lay-ups we get which is more than most teams. We blew several last night. The live by the 3 die by the 3 just doesn't stand up to scrutiny. Even when we upset Duke in JBs 2nd season, they had more 3 pointers than we did. Don't get me wrong, we take a lot of them but there is much more to the offense than that.

'shoes

Sigh....My bad. I guess we will back door cut ourselves to a NC. I don't know what I was worried about.

we probably aren't a NC caliber team- of course who clearly is?, but we as fans tend to overrate our teams at the apex and underrate them at the bottom.

'shoes

We are 3-2 against MSU in our last 5 games.

In 2 of those wins Michigan shot under 30%.

There is more to his offense than 3pt shots.

Level-headed as always Shoes. I'm not freaking out too badly because I never really thought we were a top 5 team. I continue to believe that we are in the 10-15 range. I know nobody likes excuses, but the last game was partly a result of being at the end of super tough four game stretch where the previous two games had gone to OT. There are some legit weaknesses on this team, not the least of which is youth. But you take away this one game and would anybody be that upset right now? I think with some additional rest and practice time coming up and some easier opponents, they will bounce back strong. It will be VERY interesting to see how they do at home against IU and MSU.

I personnally think that the MSU game happen at the worst time for Michigan. Being they wanted that game at their whore house and we had 2 game go overtime one on a last second shot from half court. That being said Belien should have played more zone to alliviate the fatigue , maybe go to a double inside post where you would have put a combination of Horford and McGary or Morgan and McGary to help the defense on MSU post play.

I realize fan is short for fanatic but I think most of you would be characterized as delusional. It's right there in front of you. You ignore the fact that Michigan was #1 already and was on the verge of being #1 again. You fall into the Michigan mentality set your goals lower so you won't be disappointed with crap like "we're a 10-15 team" or We're not a NC caliber team." This team a week or so ago only had one loss. Why can't we view it as a NC challenger?

This team has been very impressive statistically in turnovers, fouls given and scoring. Apparently we're pretty good in points off of back door cuts. Again, Why can't we be a NC challenger?

As far as I am concerned I still have high hopes for a tourney run. My only complaint is the lack of mental toughness and a inside game. I think if you are going to sacrifice center for a PF your PF had better be able to hit 15 footers with ease and also better be able to run a big oversized center not named Zeller into the ground. Trying to post them up or make a career out of fadeaway jumpers and hook shots are not going to cut it.

The writing is on the wall. They need to get the their post problem shored up or they will lose against MSU and IU in AA and will probably see a early exit from the tourney. I like artists idea of using two of our "bigs" at the same time. If GR3 is going to be a no show then you might as well get some help in the post.

I don't think that's delusional, I think it's realistic. This is entertainment, every fan has a different way of approaching it. I try to be as realistic as possible when viewing the team, and that's how I get the most enjoyment out of following them. Others take the approach that they have to set their expectations very high and that's how they enjoy following the team. Neither approach is wrong, IMO, and neither approach will change where the team ultimately ends up (that I know for sure).

We are on a forum and I think we can all agree that whatever is discussed here will not have a impact on the court or field. Glad we go that out of the way.

As for being realistic; I have another term for it-settling. This team won the NIT against some descent competition. I am not going to re-hash all the statistical categories that Michigan is nearly leading the COUNTRY in. There is absolutely no reason this team should not be in the discussion for the NC. None. Yet we have fans here that seemingly are packing it up and bracing for a average finish to the season.

Sorry but I expect more. This team needs to perform better than it has the last few games.

jjabilene wrote:

Level-headed as always Shoes. I'm not freaking out too badly because I never really thought we were a top 5 team. I continue to believe that we are in the 10-15 range. I know nobody likes excuses, but the last game was partly a result of being at the end of super tough four game stretch where the previous two games had gone to OT. There are some legit weaknesses on this team, not the least of which is youth. But you take away this one game and would anybody be that upset right now? I think with some additional rest and practice time coming up and some easier opponents, they will bounce back strong. It will be VERY interesting to see how they do at home against IU and MSU.

I dare you to try to name 9-14 teams that would beat Michigan on a neutral court.

Pittsburgh is the favorite to win the Big East right now and Michigan beat them on a neutral court.
Kansas St. is tied for 1st in the Big 12 and Michigan spanked them on a neutral court.

Tier 1:
Indiana
Duke

Tier 2:
Florida
Kansas
Michigan
Michigan St.

Tier 3:
Miami
Louisville
Gonzaga
Syracuse


I don't know how much you guys follow college basketball, but I do a lot. Every team I just listed has worse losses than Michigan has, besides Duke.

I don't know if there's even a clear separation between your tiers. Right now I would give you 3 maybe even 4 teams of your choosing and I would take the field for the title. I would not do that most years, but this year I would.

'shoes

Last year is the only year I would have bet against the field with 3 or 4 teams and that is just because that Kentucky team was loaded.


But the fact remains that you can't find 10 teams with better resumes than Michigan.

We're not actually that far apart in our view of the team. I said 10-15 (maybe I should have just said 10th), they're 6th in RPI, 5th on Ken Pom, and will be like 7th or 8th when the polls come out next week. That's not exactly the grand canyon there. I think part of the reason I downgrade them (slightly) is that I think the number of freshman they rely on heavily will be an issue in the tournament. One thing that is a positive for us is that it's really wide open this year. There is no dominant team out there by any stretch.